Island Life: Let’s learn English, with John Key.
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he's also not entitled to cry foul when speculation fills the gap.
Surely Craig you're talkin about yr man Key bitching about journos? You know, the ones who are bored by National's deliberate policy vacuum. The ones desperate for a story that isn't about how freakin amazing he is. The ones now resorting to reading the tealeaves and not even asking where the grubby mug came from?
Keeping quiet obviously has its downsides as a strategy. Soundbite journalism needs constant feeding, or the hacks get ornery.
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And yes, I found wading through this whole thread in one go more than a touch florid.
"I left them on the kitchen bench', smiles English embarrassingly.
And funny - bravo. :)
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Yet your seem so happy to do the same caricature unto others?........
Yeah, Dave, people who don't agree with me don't believe in democracy. I prefer Stephen Colbert who actually intends statements like that to be read as a joke. *shakes head*
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On both TV3 Campbell live, and Back Benches tonight,an empty chair, then the empty slot with Wallace, (the show just before Media 7) was not what I would consider good tactics at a time of transparency.
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National's deliberate policy vacuum
And as an interested party abroad, I've spent the last hour or so trying to work out National's Foreign and Defence policies from their website and elswhere. There is this from a speech some months back but it says little and is at best vacuous and non-committal. Lets sign an FTA with the US, be more like Ireland and align ourselves with Asia are hardly novel policy stances.
An honest question...is there anything more substantial than this out there, or is this it on that too?
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An honest question...or is this it on that too?
Nothing more substantial that I have noticed. Policies for the National Party seem to be fluffy ducks to me.
A case of Labour can, National can do better.
Yeah, better get me a bucket :)
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WH,
if you had higher aspirations for our country you wouldn't write things like this david. what goes on between candidate and fish is frankly none of your concern.
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On both TV3 Campbell live, and Back Benches tonight,an empty chair, then the empty slot with Wallace, (the show just before Media 7) was not what I would consider good tactics at a time of transparency.
Well, Sophie, I must admit that Campbell Live dropped off my media radar a while back, but what did Campell have to say to the furniture?
Meanwhile, what's 'bad tactics' about deciding not to give the story any more legs? (Assuming you want to give tonight's effort any serious attention.) Helen Clark does it all the time, and I don't recall anyone around here issuing invites to the wake for democracy every bloody time she declines an interview request.
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Can we put people who use "going forward" into the naughty boy/girl corner?
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This debate (here) is amusing because neither 'side' is budging from their previously held views on National/John Key. Actually I think the same could be said of the wider debate. These tapes mean whatever you want them to mean. For Nats they are harmless/innocent/the truth. For those that don't support National they are proof that National is slippery/untrustworthy/have a hidden agenda.
IMO the tapes are not that damaging. It's just politics as usual. All parties play to the centre vote, whilst at the same time giving a wink and a nod to their hardcore (left or right) supporters that once elected they'll start working on those bedrock issues.
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John:
Fair points, well made. But, seriously, did anyone else watch tonight's effort, and think Debbie Does Dallas (sorry, 'Deep Throat' is spoken for) is kinda flogging a scared horse. :)
"We are quite deliberately in neutralise phase at the moment. We don't want to fight the election on Kiwisaver. You got to decide what you want to fight the election on. We want to fight the election on tax. We want to the fight election on education standards. We want to fight the election on law and order."
OK, I don't think anyone who's actually been involved in politics for more than ten seconds can read anything horribly sinister into that. No more than, I'm sure Labour's strategists would like to see any number of issues "neutralised".
But, of course, what you want and what you get seldom coincide. Bugger.
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" It's just politics as usual. "
move along, nothing to hear here, just politics, nothing to concern yourselves with, drink more beer and go to bed.game over.
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move along, nothing to hear here, just politics, nothing to concern yourselves with, drink more beer and go to bed.game over.
Jeremy: Well, James does have a point. I'm sure there are plenty of people in National who don't like the taste of sushi one little bit. In many respects, I'm one of them. Just as I know folks in Labour who'd really like Helen Clark to stop pissing around and deliver that Socialist Paradise. If you're running a personality cult a la Winston Peters, dealing with these people is easy. Assassinate their characters and purge the remains. If you're leading a broad-base center-left or center-right party, then things are a little more complicated.
Not a 'secret agenda', Jeremy. Obstinate, annoying reality.
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A S,
You got it in one, John.
On a slight tangent, but related to the whole "secret agenda" spin, I'd really quite like an announcement to be made about when the election is going to be.
Enough of this policy vacuum to-and-fro rubbish, how about actually the PM making a call and NZ entering the actual electioneering period so we can get the policies from ALL parties on the table so we can decide for ourselves.
It seems a bit rich to criticise the nats for not announcing policy, or having secret agendas, when it seems to be a clear tactic by labour to not actually announce an election date (and the associated pre-election/campaign period to release policies into).
I don't want to be faced with a miniscule pre-election period that is devoted to spin by all sides, I'd rather have some time to think things through myself.
Perhaps some questions should be being asked of the incumbent administration on when we plebs might expect to be told about an election?
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Enough of this policy vacuum to-and-fro rubbish, how about actually the PM making a call and NZ entering the actual electioneering period so we can get the policies from ALL parties on the table so we can decide for ourselves.
As I said elsewhere, I can't see any practical or genuine constitutional issues around fixing the election date unless the Government loses confidence and supply, in which case, the election must be held in six weeks. The strategic interests of the Government of the day -- and it's hard to argue that the snap elections of '51, '84 and 2002 were called for any other reason -- are out of the equation.
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I think I have singled out the most damaging admission made by the Nats this week:
In hindsight Dr Smith realised the man could not have been a Young Nat - he was too "hip".
(Obligatory link to the article) (Love the photo of Key's rubbish strewn across the lawn. I'm trying to picture him taking it. "The public must see this!")
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Those rubbish pictures are a disgrace.
They are incontrovertible evidence that the National Party does not recycle (exception: their candidates). Several items on the grass belong in the blue bins. John Key needs to clear up this mess and sort it out.
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__I get the impression with National that they're adopting a George Bush-Iraq-911-terrorist type strategy.__
Would you care to expand, or was that just a pretext to shoe-horn a poo-some Bush namecheck into the discussion?
OK. Bush repeated the phrases "Iraq" and "911" and "terrorist" and "weapons of mass destruction" next to each other in speeches umpteen times while building the case to invade Iraq, without actually saying that Iraq was involved in 911 (which of course wasn't true).
I get the impression that National is just going to keep on saying "stolen emails" again and again, even though both Hager, and the police have said "not stolen", as that's the impression they want to lay over the top of the whole hollow men story, play, film etc.
In much the same way that the impression that they want to lay over these recorded conversations is "Labour activists", "immoral recording" etc.
Fight against the substance by ignoring it and pointing at the method.
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Meanwhile, what's 'bad tactics' about deciding not to give the story any more legs?
My point here was the furniture, (although not what I would use in my house), was not a good tactic if The Nats wanted to portray their "no hidden agenda" stance.It would be fine to decline interviews (as anyone can) but to accept then not show when it appeared to leave two shows without their chairs filled, that just feeds the fire.Especially after Key saying it was "good news" ,they had tapes and they would find the culprit! Now on bfm this morning, he has to go as soon as it was getting more legs (as you put it).Why did it matter if anyone heard what was taped.?If it wasn't meant to be heard, then as a well paid opposition mp they should be aware they are accountable to us.The simple folk who pays their wages.
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Kyle, this is for you.
Aww. But I know you secretly recorded my idea, and you're clearly now Labour Youth.
__Craig, for or against Woodward, Bernstein and Deep Throat?__
Thank you, David!
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Way to not answer the question.
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Several items on the grass belong in the blue bins. John Key needs to clear up this mess and sort it out.
:)
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Way to not answer the question.
Kyle - whatever. To paraphrase Margaret Wilson once more: Not really my problem if the answer isn't to your satisfaction.
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A S,
As I said elsewhere, I can't see any practical or genuine constitutional issues around fixing the election date unless the Government loses confidence and supply, in which case, the election must be held in six weeks. The strategic interests of the Government of the day -- and it's hard to argue that the snap elections of '51, '84 and 2002 were called for any other reason -- are out of the equation.
Well, fixing an election date, and having a set pre-election/campaign period would certainly be a much more democratic approach ....
I get the impression that National is just going to keep on saying "stolen emails" again and again, even though both Hager, and the police have said "not stolen", as that's the impression they want to lay over the top of the whole hollow men story, play, film etc.
In much the same way that the impression that they want to lay over these recorded conversations is "Labour activists", "immoral recording" etc.
Fight against the substance by ignoring it and pointing at the method.
Sounds remarkably similar to the "slippery john", "hidden agendas", "selling of state assets" spin that comes from labour.
Neither side looks good on that particular front.
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To paraphrase Margaret Wilson once more: Not really my problem if the answer isn't to your satisfaction.
I liked her "Everyone knows I have style and taste" when referring to the new look Rodney :)
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Love the photo of Key's rubbish strewn across the lawn.
*peers*
I see a fair bit of McDonald's packaging strewn around there. Now, I'm not familiar with rubbish disposal in Helensville and welcome enlightenment from other PASers, but if we're talking plastic bags and if there are stray dogs in that electorate, I think we might have found likely suspects.
In before Labour's running dogs, etc.
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