Hard News: Holiday Open Thread 2: Chewing over the News
537 Responses
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Craig Ranapia, in reply to
Again, Matthew, I've read Robert Caro's Master of the Senate and am aware there were no group hugs and singing of Kum-bay-a in Congress during the passage of the Civil Rights Act. (I also know it was so heavily compromised that enforcement was difficult, if not actually impossible.)
But, again, I'd not Strom Thurmond -- segregationist double wide douche nozzle that he was -- filibustered for over 24 hours with no mention of "second amendment solutions" or slurs against Eisenhower. The collegial civility was often through gritted teeth (and a lot of people nursing their twisted arms when Johnson was involved), but it was real.
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Craig Ranapia, in reply to
because enfranchisement was just the biggest issue of a multitude of segregationist matters that were addressed in that period in the South but which hadn’t been a consideration in the North for quite some time.
Um, I do have to go out now but I'm going to hit you with a reading list concerning "segregationist issues" that were very big issues north of the Mason-Dixon line. I'm probably being every bit as reductionist as you are, but the reality was much messier. And more interesting.
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which hadn’t been a consideration in the North for quite some time
I suppose it depends on what you mean by 'quite some time': in many northern states miscegenation laws were still in effect until the mid-1950s, for example. Actually, I see someone has handily broken down the stats here. I love the internet!
The south definitely sucked the most, no question. But the north hadn't entirely sorted itself out, either.
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The Obama claim however is based on....
...catering to the tastes of the credulous who invariably will believe the worst of political opposites.
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nzlemming, in reply to
The Obama claim however is based on….
…catering to the tastes of the credulous who invariably will believe the worst of political opposites.
You really don't get irony, do you, Angus?
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Simon Grigg, in reply to
The south definitely sucked the most, no question. But the north hadn't entirely sorted itself out, either.
And of course the huge influx of black folks from the south to the north and to the aircraft factories of California (which didn't ratify the 15th Amendment until 1962!) in the 1940s threw everything before into a spin.
However for all that the lynchings were a particular feature of the south and the KKK had some, but rarely significant, traction in the North after the 1920s.
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Ray Gilbert, in reply to
I'd not seen it for 25 odd years and I'm buzzing off it.
Ah memories - nothing like good old 1980s police brutality. I got a bit of it myself.
On a lighter note the 80's dancing in bright colored shirts thing reminds me a lot of the Wiggles
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Interesting post at Open Left – Stochastic Terrorism
The person who actually plants the bomb or assassinates the public official is not the stochastic terrorist, they are the “missile” set in motion by the stochastic terrorist. The stochastic terrorist is the person who uses mass media as their means of setting those “missiles” in motion.
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Meanwhile, I think we have a new champ in the victimhood stakes:
Tuscon Tea Party co-founder Trent Humphries called Giffords’ previous concerns about violent rhetoric “political gamesmenship,” claiming that if Giffords was so concerned, then she is to blame for Saturday’s shootings because she “had no security whatsoever”:
“It’s political gamesmanship. The real case is that she [Giffords] had no security whatsoever at this event. So if she lived under a constant fear of being targeted, if she lived under this constant fear of this rhetoric and hatred that was seething, why would she attend an event in full view of the public with no security whatsoever?” he said. “For all the stuff they accuse her [Palin] of, that gun poster has not done a tenth of the damage to the political discourse as what we’re hearing right now.”
What awful, awful people.
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Martin Lindberg, in reply to
then she is to blame for Saturday’s shootings because she “had no security whatsoever”
What is this I don't even
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reminds me a lot of the Wiggles
...previously known as the Cockroaches, neatly tying today's threads together.
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I'll see your Trent Humphries chappie and raise you an Erick son of Erick:
Out there somewhere is someone who would love to kill Governor Palin. God forbid they do it. But you and I both know there is some crazy MSNBC watcher and Media Matters reader who even now is dreaming of doing so.
And should they try, we can be equally sure of something else. The left will be divided into two camps: (1) bitch deserved it and (2) not my fault.
It is unfortunate. I hope it never happens. But you and I both know the reality in which we live.
http://www.balloon-juice.com/2011/01/13/hes-just-a-shot-away-hes-just-a-shot-away/
...with an assist from Beck who assures us that the Republic may not survive such a happening, which would obviously be worse than the civil war, the cold war, WWII, and a long enough list of actual presidential assassinations all rolled up into a newspaper to swat liberals with.
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You really don't get irony, do you, Angus?
Two unsubstantiable claims side by side.
The US President is:
- a practicing Muslim.
- a murderer, a torturer, a war criminal.Supposedly we now have hate filled rhetoric in place of the civilised debate of just a few years ago.
I see irony.
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recordari, in reply to
... glorious fuckedupitude of the whole country.
Exqueeze me? Ahem. Just sayin'.
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Sacha, in reply to
bringing logic to a knife fight.
Teeworthy
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Matthew Poole, in reply to
Two unsubstantiable claims side by side.
The US President is:
- a practicing Muslim.
- a murderer, a torturer, a war criminal.Do you deny that torture is a war crime?
Do you deny that the CIA and military intelligence, agencies of the US Executive, used torture in Iraq?
Do you deny that there is some degree of evidence that the torture was carried out in accordance with a policy, rather than ad-hoc by some rogue CIA and MI officers?
Do you deny that there is some degree of evidence that the policy was promulgated from the White House?Which part of suggestions that Bush II is a war criminal do you consider to be of the same degree of accuracy as suggestions that Obama is a Muslim?
For one there is objective, accepted fact (torturing PoW’s is a war crime, and there was torture of PoW’s in Iraq at the hands of US military and CIA personnel), and some degree of evidence that would support at least an initial court hearing.
For the other there is “His father’s a Muslim, his middle name is ‘Hussein’, ergo, he’s a Muslim.” -
"For the other there is “His father’s a Muslim, his middle name is ‘Hussein’, ergo, he’s a Muslim.”"
That's not fair! He's also a bit too swarthy to be a real American.
And you know who else isn't a real murkin? Muslims, that's who.
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Danielle, in reply to
Exqueeze me?
Where 'glorious' may also mean 'awe-inspiring, in a bad way'.
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‘awe-inspiring in a bad way’,
My new goal in life. ;-)
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Joe Wylie, in reply to
Out there somewhere is someone who would love to kill Governor Palin. God forbid they do it.
Deja vu all over again.
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Simon Grigg, in reply to
Two unsubstantiable claims side by side.
Only if you've been living under a rock for the past 8 years.....
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For one there is objective, accepted fact (torturing PoW’s is a war crime, and there was torture of PoW’s in Iraq at the hands of US military and CIA personnel), and some degree of evidence that would support at least an initial court hearing.
Eric Holder (and the Democrat run US Senate oversight comittees) have had unfettered access to all actual proof that exists. There has been no court hearing.
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I want what he's smoking
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Simon Grigg, in reply to
Eric Holder (and the Democrat run US Senate oversight comittees) have had unfettered access to all actual proof that exists. There has been no court hearing.
^^ Sacha
Perhaps you missed the fairly extensive discussions just after Obama was elected where the possibility that Bush might be prosecuted was the central topic. Obama decided that no good would come of it and decided to move on. It caused a great deal of dissent and upset amongst some of those who had worked towards Obama's election.
What's it like under that rock, Angus? Damp or dry?
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It is a shame there hasn't been a court hearing.
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