Hard News: Friday Music: Some Year
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mark taslov, in reply to
– Ella does the words and vocals and Joel Little does the music,
Yeah, despite the marketing angle, It's hard to be quite sure how cut and dried that is since this quote that Russell posted:
She works with producer Joel Little whom she credits with turning her "pages and pages of something" into song form. "You know how Raymond Carver had Gordon Lish, the editor who made him what he was? I feel like Joel was that for me.
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mark taslov, in reply to
Read the teenage girls’ tweets
That doesn’t sound like something I’d be too keen on truth be told ;)
“The men don’t know, but the little girls understand.”
Maybe it’s just me but I don’t find cissexual assumption helpful or particularly relevant. perhaps best left in the 1940s – the assumption. The tune is great.
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This is Lana Del Rey's Ride remixed by Paul Woolford aka Special Request, in a proper early 90s jungliest hardcore style. It's a banger!
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Elton John/Bernie Taupin partnership
Sorry I was busy – And yes, that shoe does fit a lot more comfortably Ian, it does appear to be Ella’s brand which isn’t a great departure from what I mentioned earlier:
The solo artist via team, filling the charts with commercials for their moniker
A butler Alfred and a Lucius Fox behind every Batman, in contrast to Gotye who broke that mold entirely. Something that was not fully followed up on in the way Lorde was marketed. And so in a sense, creatively at least;
is it a dual entity?
remains the great unanswered question...compared to say Janice Ian.
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mark taslov, in reply to
Most cynically expounded on in this comment under the Ann Powers piece:
You’re correct in thinking that Lorde is more like Alanis Morrissette than Kurt Cobain, but unfortunately not for the reason you probably intended. Morrissette was as much a manufactured record industry creation as Lorde is. Alanis was also discovered as a teen, paired up with producers and songwriters from the record company, given songs to sing, and given an “edgy” persona to go with it. Lorde is no different. Her music was all written by her co-writer, a 30 year old named Joel Little, and her lyrics are likely mostly his work as well. So, the same industry that brought you Katy Perry, Miley Cyrus, Britney Spears, and Lana Del Rey are now bringing you Lorde. The backstory of her being “just a kid” who writes her own songs is completely silly. No “kid” gets signed to a record label at 12 years old, is groomed for 5 years, and creates their own destiny. These things are planned to the very last detail, for the maximum impact and highest sales. It’s working too, just like they always do. Good for Lorde, and the album sounds really good for what it is, but the whole “voice of a generation” thing is nonsense. She’s as much a voice of her generation as Justin Bieber is. Again, another kid discovered young, mentored by the recording industry, and given songs to sing and an image to go with it.
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Russell Brown, in reply to
Her music was all written by her co-writer, a 30 year old named Joel Little, and her lyrics are likely mostly his work as well.
Except for the part where that’s total fucking bullshit.
She wrote her lyrics, for god’s sake. She was diagnosed gifted at the age of six and represented New Zealand in a literature quiz at the age of 12 (she came second in the world). She’s written since she was a small child. Her mother is a respected poet.. I’ve spoken to one of her previous co-writers, who said she came in with wild lyrical imagery. If anything, Joel Little’s contribution will have been whittling that down.
But it’s also not as if she filed her lyrics and turned up later to hear how the song sounded. They worked on it together. I’ve talked to Campbell Smith, whose office was through the wall, and to her mother, who had to drive over from the shore and pick her up night after night. That’s what happened. Certainly, it’s reasonable to suppose it was she brought the lyrical ideas and Little who crafted many of the hooks, but did she craft “And every song is like ..”? Absolutely she did.
I’m enjoying the discussion about this Mark, but to suppose she was some sort of puppet for whom other people crafted an identity is woefully, deeply and demonstrably wrong. She’s signed a $2.5m publishing deal with a hot company which includes her writing songs for other artists.
If we’re sticking with the comparison, then I think that maybe Little is Butch Vig – the pop-savvy composer who helped the artists shape what they had into something huge.
Edit: I can see that you might not exactly agree with the comment you quoted Mark, but it's something that really annoys me. Glib dismissals by people who don't actually know what they're on about.
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mark taslov, in reply to
I can see that you might not exactly agree with the comment you quoted Mark
Yeah, I have no clue, that comment was just something I encountered and is obviously (mis)informed by ambiguity in the way Lorde has been marketed – speculation fueled. This emphasis on Ella as child prodigy from a literary family is almost inviting the reaction of that commentator, not in the least helped by, as noted incorrectly, the *4* year period between signing and the unveiling . The music stands up by itself IMHO.
I am likewise enjoying the discussion, Ella, Joel, this work, and the phenomenon it’s created is far more deserving of further analysis than so much pulp we’re served.
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Danielle, in reply to
I... OK. That really doesn't have anything to do with "cissexual assumptions". It's been used for a while as a shorthand for the way in which pop culture develops these schisms: young girls tend to "get" the great things about pop music while older guys tend not to. (I first heard it used in reference to Phil Spector's Wall of Sound, actually.) I was just playing on Russell's comment about the teenage girls' tweets. And now I have thoroughly ruined the reference by over-explaining it, I will end this post. :)
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mark taslov, in reply to
Do go on, genuinely. I’m not at all clear on what you’re saying there Danielle. After all, the only reason I responded is that you were quoting directly from my post
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Sacha, in reply to
just music
can't escape context, dude :)
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mark taslov, in reply to
Again?
is absolutely massive, no question about it, both in terms of pop music and western pop culture.
As Russell later said:
She looks different
pop culture
and she sounds different
pop music.
Stevie Wonder gets to appreciate one of these two facets of Lorde, it's the Friday music post, and that's where my interest lies, I feel comfortable commenting on the music.
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Sacha, in reply to
The style that Joel and Ella have wrought as Lorde is influential in their industry both in content and production.
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Sacha, in reply to
Stevie Wonder gets to appreciate one of these two facets of Lorde
blind people aren't ignorant of pop culture, if that's what you're saying.
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mark taslov, in reply to
I guess the question there is Sacha do you sincerely believe that I am saying that pop culture and pop music are two facets of Lorde, or would it be more likely that the way she looks and the way she sounds are the two facets of Lorde being referred to?
If it wasn’t clear;p the facets of Lorde I referred to are the way she looks and the way she sounds.
IMHO, the way she sounds fits snuggly within the parameters of both music and culture, the way she looks fits within culture, and as an element in the performance of the music, but ultimately distinct from the (pure) music itself, in that it can’t be detected by the naked ear unless the artist is sporting some close mic-ed taffeta or something. I’m interested in what I can hear. That quote you excerpted above outlined the limitations of my comment and possible contribution.
My reasoning for prefacing my comment in that way was that I do understand that pop music means so much more to most people; the look, the moves, the lighting, costume and hairstyle etc.
The style that Joel and Ella have wrought as Lorde is influential in their industry both in content and production.
Absolutely, no question about it, No 1, And based on what I’ve read here today I’d guess it’s the lyrics that’ll have the biggest influence. And still, the whole package will be light years more influential than the Lightning Twins ;)
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Guys, guys, I think you might be over thinking it. Just a little bit.
Anyhoo, last night I ventured to two summer solstice concerts of considerable contrast.
The first, as above, Finn Family Christmas, which reminded me that Neil, Tim and their broods (SWIDT?) have a huge legacy in New Zealand music, and whatever your feelings about it, a grand old singalong to Fall at your feet is pretty damn uplifting.
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Part deux.
Then I flipped over to Whammy to catch a short but sweet set by the Hallelujah Picassos. Having a merry old dance to Rewind was another highlight of the evening.
And home by midnight. Old dudes have to sleep you know.
Get amongst it.
Happy daze.
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mark taslov, in reply to
I think you might be over thinking it. Just a little bit.
Hehe, I was lying in bed unable to nod off, mulling over why the spokesman for a generation is always white and a musician…yeah for sure PJ. Nice pics, cool to see in the deep of winter.
Thank you. hibernation beckons.
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Not normally a fan of Christmas songs, but
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fCNvZqpa-7Q "White Wine in the Sun" by Tim Minchin really affected me.
I see he is donating all proceeds from downloads of this song over Xmas to the (I assume Australian) National Autistic Society. -
Pete,
Leaving aside those already mentioned, my year had these
Chvrches – Recover
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=JyqemIbjcfg
Savages – She Will
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=kebq-cENNn0
Sleigh Bells’ Bitter Rivals
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=Cr-ahiFDktsVolcano Choir,Rhye,Neko Case,Mt Kimbie
So much good music
This pic is North American Twitter when Bey’s album dropped
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A pretty good year for music? I'd say so. I haven't gone to as many gigs this year as I'd like to have (curse you, Deerhunter, for cancelling your European tour!), but I managed Esben and the Witch and Thought Forms:
Plus Veronica Falls and the Kristin Hersh/Throwing Muses album launch:
Here's a Spotify playlist I ended up making of new music that moved me in 2013, compiled kinda in response to the Guardian's predictably popist top 40 (which, natch, excluded pretty much all of it). -
Robyn Gallagher, in reply to
Read the teenage girls' tweets about her - she's shifted ideals of beauty in pop culture. It is quite a thing to carry.
Tweets are one big difference between Lorde and Gotye. When Lorde tweets anything, there will be a large number of responses simply saying "Queen". This is the sort of adulation that popstars like Miley and Beyonce and Nicki Minaj get. Gotye, meanwhile, is a more serious older dude musician with little mass appeal to teenz.
I think this is what's going to keep Lorde going and ensure she won't be a one-hit wonder in America. She's already done the song for the Hunger Games soundtrack and seems to be working on all sorts of intriguing secret projects with hot producers. In a way, Lorde in 2014 will be far more interesting than Lorde in 2013.
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Craig Ranapia, in reply to
In a way, Lorde in 2014 will be far more interesting than Lorde in 2013.
Yup - being a one hit/album wonder is (relatively) easy, up to a point. Sustaining it is harder. And doing that without eventually turning into a self-parodying tax exile? That's damn near impossible.
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