Hard News: Congratulations, Mr Key
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Rik,
You really thought his patronising rant about voters having been "bribed with their own money" for the last three years cut to the quick of the financial crisis? The public accounts are not the problem.
Yep!
But he wasn't referring to the global economic turmoil - he is still thinking about cleaning up after Labour's Robin Hood-style bribery over the last several years.
Hey - I quite like that analogy. If Helen Clarke was Robin Hood where do Cullen and some of the others fit in to the band of merry men?
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Pita Sharples respectfully declared himself willing to talk with National, emphasising that any accord would need to be good for both parties ("mana enhancement" he called it).
I'm not sure that's exactly what mana enhancement means - you may have fallen into the same trap as Barry Soper (I think) on Agenda.
Maori Party president Whatarangi Winiata was explaining that the dialogue between National and the Māori Party would have to be "mana enhancing" explaining that Māori Party ideas would have to receive serious consideration, etc.
Barry then asked (transcript not yet up, so not a direct quote) "well, what if the National Party were to stick with their policy to abolish the Māori seats, that wouldn't exactly be mana enhancing?"
Professor Winiata disagreed, noting that such a position could well be an expression of National's rangatiratanga.
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People should stop grumbling about a lack of diversity in National's caucus...
Hey, grumble away -- but know WTF you're talking about and just as a small courtesy could Sam Lotu-Iiga, Simon Bridges, Kanwalijit Bakshi, Melissa Lee, Hekia Parata and Paul Quinn be sworn in before their ethnic "realness" is under question?
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I heard that 18-25 years old vote was way down. Anyone know where I can see that?
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Re: the numbers. If the Maori Party abstain on a vote, would National be able to pass legislation alone?
Should be obvious if I looked up the numbers but you poli-cats must have diced this a thousand ways already... :>
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Oh I know all that, Craig, blah blah blah. It just took too long to say, and I knew you'd say it anyway. So... thanks :D. It was all just setup for calling Roger Douglas a zombie, anyway.
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You might want to take some Eno, give your gut a rest and start using your eyes.
Cos the celebration of ethnic diversity within National is soooo visible right Craig?
In my eyes - and my only bias is a desire for inclusiveness - National are still the party that came in their pants after Brash's Orewa speech. Did I miss a warm and fuzzy flip-flop on that score?
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I heard that 18-25 years old vote was way down. Anyone know where I can see that?
Could that go some way to explaining the 2% of the party vote that never turned up for the Greens? It was looking like 8% minimum for them, I thought.
WRT "mana" I'm tempted to paraphrase Humpty Dumpty: it means whatever the user wants it to mean - nothing more, nothing less.
Any guesses for Goff's deputy?
Mahuta would be an interesting choice.
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Rik: it's National - with Act support - who wet the electors' appetite for tax bribes in 2005.
Bribing us with our own money is precisely what the National party have been doing. Just because Labour have a welfare programme hardly makes them outstanding in this regard.
Besides, better for a gummint to be a Robin Hood than Dick Turpin.
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I know Hekia Parata (for one example), and if you think she's just some Auntie Tom house nigger brown-wash I've got a slightly used Harbour Bridge at a knockdown price.
So it's unlikely that she'll be forced to smilingly swallow a sackload of dead rats, as Georgina did under Brash and McCully? Good to hear, you've come a long way from Orewa, baby.
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Professor Winiata disagreed, noting that such a position could well be an expression of National's rangatiratanga.
Weird. That's maybe nice in theory, but you'd have to wonder what the MP are getting for their people, and party.
I get the impression that the Maori Party need a term in power to start to learn some interesting truths. It'll be interesting to see their approach in three years.
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And according to DPF's figures, National now has more female MPs than Labour.
Re Akld Central - Judith just didn't seem to want it that much. I live work in the electorate, and the only time I saw her the whole campaign was the last Friday, driving up Queen St screaming through loudspeakers. I think she just assumed that she had it in the bag.
Roger Douglas - shudder - the Night of the Living Dead
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If the Maori Party abstain on a vote, would National be able to pass legislation alone?
Having counted it myself (not a strong point) I'm saying yes? Which to me is a very very good thing - ACT don't have quite the power they like to think they do.
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Hey, grumble away -- but know WTF you're talking about and just as a small courtesy could Sam Lotu-Iiga, Simon Bridges, Kanwalijit Bakshi, Melissa Lee, Hekia Parata and Paul Quinn be sworn in before their ethnic "realness" is under question?
At a caucus level, National is definitely growing its diversity, which is very good to see.
However, when you look at the top 20 - from which the cabinet positions are likely to come - you can see that diversity clearly gives way to pakeha men who are (or are approaching) middle age.
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If the Maori Party abstain on a vote, would National be able to pass legislation alone?
Proportionally? Or in total? Cause they also have a lot more MPs and it's about the proportional makeup of it.
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Wait, disregard my mis-pasted jibberish... :?
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The Greens always do worse in election polls than media polls.
Lots of reasons. But mainly:
One: Labour supporters are (misguidedly) afraid that Labour will miss out if they vote for Green.
Two: The Greens fail to realise their vote from non-Labour supporters.
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However, when you look at the top 20 - from which the cabinet positions are likely to come - you can see that diversity clearly gives way to pakeha men who are (or are approaching) middle age.
Now there's a shock.
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Re- ACT and National
Are they going to return to collective Cabinet responsibility? On policy matters (putting aside financial shenanigans) Dunne & Peters had a lot of leeway under Clark. It is hard to see ACT putting up with the old fashioned facade where everything the government does is always right. No way will Rodney & co be dining on the rodents, especially given what they've said even after the election.
Key would be better off giving them room to rant, I reckon. While instructing Epsom Nats to start looking for a Simon Bridges, very publicly ("nice electorate you got here, Rodney, it'd be a real shame if something happened to it, know what I mean, guv?").
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Rik,
James
it's National - with Act support - who wet the electors' appetite for tax bribes in 2005
It all depends which way you look at this.
If you are a high payer of income tax then you might say that Labour dropped a few bribes (interest free student loans, for example).
If you are a beneficiary you might say National/ACT have dropped a few bribes (lower taxes).
It is my personal opinion that the top tax rate kicks in way too early - as soon as you hit that it's barely worth working. From memory in the US Obama was talking about the top tax rate kicking in at a household income of around USD200k (or was it USD300k?) whereas here it kicks in at around NZD60k which roughly equates to about USD36k.
I'm all for ensuring nobody slips through the cracks but I'm not so keen on ensuing everyone can live the life of Riley (whatever that means) on the back of the relatively small minority in NZ that pay the vast majority of the total tax take.
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'Apparently Mr Douglas "favours... every New Zealander getting the same health care and education that the rich get."'
He means having the opportunity to pay personally for those same services. Rog has a bit of a blind spot when it comes to appreciating what poverty is about.
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However, when you look at the top 20 - from which the cabinet positions are likely to come - you can see that diversity clearly gives way to pakeha men who are (or are approaching) middle age.
We're all approaching middle-age -- except for those of us who crash out the other side, and wondered what the hell happened to our backs.
Are they going to return to collective Cabinet responsibility?
One can only hope, the whole TARDIS-like aspect of Winston Peters' tenure as Foreign Affairs Minister was just bizarre.
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3410,
It was an extraordinarily arrogant and presumptuous display, and the man who won 12 times more votes just sat there opposite and looked uncomfortable with it.
I hope he grows a pair soon. So far he looks less like National's leader than its mascot.
Re: greens lower-than-expected turnout. Having spoken to a number of people who were tosing up between Gr. & Lab., I'm sure it's this: Many were disappointed with Labour, intending to vote Green, but on seeing that Labour appeared to be about to be caned (and that the Greens were safely over the threshhold), went back to voting Labour, in order to mitigate the damage. IMO, this is a very common scenario.
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If anyone wants some entertainment (and has the stomach for it), the kiwiblog crowd is proposing disenfranchising Wellington, Christchurch, and Dunedin voters because they're not ideologically correct. Well, actually they want to cut them off New Zealand, but given that that is physically impossible, it seems they'll settle for disenfranchisement.
I thought they'd get LESS crazy in victory. Obviously not.
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I must admit I had to look up Ferengi but exactly right for Act
the manners and countenance of a Ferengi trader
With Rodney, Roger and even Prebble keen to put distance between themselves and the National Party they are making is easier for Key to outflank them.
Roger did National a favour by being so OTT on TV3 and from what I heard on National Radio doesn't seem to make any more sense 2 days later.
The best you can say about Sir Roger is that the cartoonists will have an easier character now that Winston has gone.
I heard some of Prebble on radio as well and he seems to have glossed over the fact that Act got the same number of seats as the Maori Party.
The best result for all of us is a scenario where the Maori Party is included even if that makes it more likely National will get a second term in 2011.
The worst thing about National's win is all that dead wood in their top 10. Lets hope Key can sidestep the two Smiths, Williamson aat the very least.
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