Hard News: About Arie
646 Responses
First ←Older Page 1 … 13 14 15 16 17 … 26 Newer→ Last
-
Arie Smith, "Face of Looting", turns out to be, in my opinion, yet another actual Christchurch Earthquake hero for the sacrifice he is choosing to make - he has chosen to hold off making a complaint about Police behaviour because of stress and his support for the excellent job the Police are doing in Christchurch.
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10711260
Lawyer, Simon Buckingham said "The one thing he doesn't want is for police to be bagged at a time they need the New Zealand public behind them." -
I agree, John.
-
Matthew Poole, in reply to
There's at least one contributor to this thread who could learn much from Arie’s attitude.
-
Sofie Bribiesca, in reply to
And worth mentioning twice eh? ;)(Herald article that is)
-
Tim Hannah, in reply to
Eh? Arie's attitude is great. The police choosing not to investigate? Not so much.
There's a difference between the collective police doing generally a great job, and one cop giving people the bash. I'm damn sure some police officers are going to deservedly get commendations and awards, after investigations of their actions.
It seems likely that another is going to get away with assault, because there'll be no investigation of his actions.
(and if there is an internal investigation it needs to be acknowledged, it would be wrong for the police to deliberately put this case into the media, and then take it internal when it suits them)
-
Matthew Poole, in reply to
Arie’s attitude is great. The police choosing not to investigate? Not so much.
No, and if they don't investigate then that's not cool. That said, the IPCA can investigate anything it wants to, and given the publicity it may well chose to investigate this case.
However, Arie's the victim. Given some of the comments in here, you'd think that certain comment-makers had been directly on the receiving end of the flying fists themselves.
-
Tim Hannah, in reply to
That article quotes the police as saying no investigation is planned. Doesn't mention an apology (I'm sure there was one, but it'd be nice to be public, given the perp walk publicity precedent).
-
However, Arie’s the victim. Given some of the comments in here, you’d think that certain comment-makers had been directly on the receiving end of the flying fists themselves.
I think people SHOULD be fucking enraged by this, actually. "Beating up suspects" isn't exactly the most defensible issue for a police apologist.
-
giovanni tiso, in reply to
Given some of the comments in here, you'd think that certain comment-makers had been directly on the receiving end of the flying fists themselves.
Whilst others come across as law and order apologists masquerading as due process concern trolls. I think I know which attitude I prefer.
-
Sacha, in reply to
However, Arie's the victim. Given some of the comments in here, you'd think that certain comment-makers had been directly on the receiving end of the flying fists themselves.
Aspies with empathy? Stop the presses!
-
Matthew Poole, in reply to
I think people SHOULD be fucking enraged by this, actually. “Beating up suspects” isn’t exactly the most defensible issue for a police apologist.
Yeah, but the comments I'm referring to didn't relate to the beating.
Nobody's suggested the beating was in any way acceptable, or defensible, if you hadn't noticed. Not even this "police apologist".
-
Sacha, in reply to
I think people SHOULD be fucking enraged by this, actually.
It's nice to see us taking the matter seriously. As raised previously, justice is meant to work on behalf of all of society, not just between the individuals at the centre of any particular incident. Particularly relevant at times of widespread social stress.
-
Matthew Poole, in reply to
Whilst others come across as law and order apologists masquerading as due process concern trolls. I think I know which attitude I prefer.
We're not much of one without the other, gio. And that's some pretty nice pejorative language you've got going there. None taken, thanks.
I get the distinct impression that a lot of people would like our police to be subjected to the same kind of inquisitorial "professional standards" system as existed in the FBI when Hoover was in charge: no idea you were being investigated until the Office of Professional Responsibility called you in for a chat, no right to a lawyer, no right of appeal, and the OPR could make a decision on your punishment with no reference to precedent set in past cases.
-
I'm very comfortable with people demanding prosecutions and convinctions. Arie's injuries are highly unlikely to have been self inflicted, I think we can all agree on that, and there is his testimony to boot. If the officers who beat him up while he was under their care are not brought charges against, that is a failure of the system, pure and simple. You can accuse us of witch-hunting as much as you want, but the facts on this matter are pretty simple: somebody beat this man up while in custody. They should be afforded due process, but not to get away with it just because.
-
Arie Smith, "Face of Looting", turns out to be, in my opinion, yet another actual Christchurch Earthquake hero
Is it possible for Arie to be both a victim as well as a perpetrator? Does he have any responsibily for the situation or has the narrative moved beyond that, to he is only a victim and now a hero?
-
MP Grant Robertson has written a concerned blog post about it all
-
Kracklite, in reply to
and I want it investigated. I also truly hope ...
Harumph. Not "I will..."
Nice job being my electorate representative, Grant. Do you also "truly hope" that I'll vote for you?
-
true.
how about, "we will question the Minister of Police in the House."
no? Labour not willing to hold the Govt to account?
Again.
-
Sacha, in reply to
the facts on this matter are pretty simple: somebody beat this man up while in custody.
Look, I'm far from an apologist for the police but we don't *know that* yet - if you want to use words like "fact" we do know that Arie sustained injuries during the process of apprehension and presentation in court and that he has through his lawyer said he was beaten. We don't need to make it more than it is.
-
Kracklite, in reply to
Aspies with empathy? Stop the presses!
My empathy works fine - just not in real time.
(and thinking of Arie, I guess it's a small mercy that the police haven't heard of the Voight-Kampff test...)
-
Sacha, in reply to
My empathy works fine
There's a current theory that we have too much of it rather than not enough - so emotion overwhelms us, like senses can overwhelm those with schizophrenia. Aloofness becomes just a defense mechanism. Makes sense to me.
-
Chris Trotter linked from Robertson's blog talks usefully about media's relationship to power, but resorts to the usual stereotypes about disabled people being incapable of anything:
But the media was wrong about that young man. He turned out to be less of a looter than he was a mentally disabled human-being utterly unequal to the task of defending himself against either physical assault or the charges brought against him. It’s doubtful he was even capable of grasping the extreme seriousness of his situation.
However, I think he is bang on about one central point:
When they learned that the items he’d stolen were light-fittings, they would have immediately known that they weren’t dealing with a case of looting, but with something entirely different. (Who risks imprisonment for light-fittings?!)
I remain keen to hear whether the Police involved had received the Autism Spectrum training that Hilary mentioned upthread, and if so why it seems to have made no difference to the outcome here. Perhaps a journalist or politician could ask that question for us?
-
Kracklite, in reply to
That's my feeling too. The "empathy" most people refer to is actually the reading of social situations, expression and suchlike. One of the things that makes us so reluctant to lie, methinks.
-
Che Tibby, in reply to
We don’t need to make it more than it is.
plus, if Arie expressing a wish to not push the envelope on this, you've got to respect it.
if you've ever encountered the rough side of justice you'll know the main loss you suffer is trust in the police. consequent to that loss is a fear that they'll "come after you". to some people the phrase 'police presence' strikes fear, not reassurance.
i can guess that Arie *could* be leaning towards the latter.
-
Sacha, in reply to
One of the things that makes us so reluctant to lie, methinks
Hadn't thought of that. Being a spectrum we're all quite diverse in how we relate to emotion and communication, but yes, the sense of fairness thing does seem to resemble that of an 8 year old boy in its purity. As does our crapness at lying.
Post your response…
This topic is closed.