Cracker: Get it Off
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quote>In the early 80s the Auckland Uni engineers were preparing to set forth in their grass skirts when they received an unexpected visit from some real Maori, who subjected them to a short sharp consciousness-raising session that put an abrupt end to the tradition. </quote> Oh god, I wonder if they still do that stupid beer floe thing. I have to admit to being one of the organisers of Orientation 1983 - and because I was responsible for the beer floe, they made me an honorary engineer. Apparently, I was a good bloke. Charming.
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Michael Fitzgerald wrote:
BMI had me a heavy when I was a lightweight rower. I've never trusted since
But BMI is not meant to be applied to an individual, it is a tool for statistical classifications of populations. As I've said, it does not take into account: muscle mass, bone density or ethnicity. A far better measure of obesity is a combined set of tests including: percentage of body fat, hip to waist ratio, triglyceride levels and glucose tolerance.
BMI is a statistical tool that is intended to be applied specifically to sedentary populations, not athletes. Athletes obviously are going to have a higher bone density, lower percentage of body fat, greater muscle mass and a favourable hip to waist ratio. BMI is only useful when discussion populations, not individuals. And it is also not of any use when applied to athletic people, it was intended to be applied to sedentary populations.
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I/O I'm being a bit hypocritical towards your passed deed and women in the sex industry?
You might have something there. -
BMI is used by Army Docs in exactly that way, along with various questions about race. Many a time I wanted to say ... Dr Goebbels I presume?
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Deborah
I think you have been dishonest about the emotional distress this has caused you.
I see on OnPoint your husband has travelled to Mlb.
Your emotional response coincides with QF38 departure & your post there it's arrival + trying to deal with customs & a lost bag.
MLB is Melbourne Florida & MEL is Melbourne Australia.
That said I'll be a little more circumspect in correspondence with pseudonyms & 1st name only posts. -
jesus michael... theatre already.
so deborah, how about it? are you able to function rationally without the calming presence of your husband?
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I can cope.
It is kind of red rag stuff 'though. Next it will all be because it must be my red rag time of the month.
Whatever, Michael. If anyone else wnats to do the analysis on this one, they are welcome. I'm going to stay out of it.
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Michael. Shut up and don't dig yourself in any further. You are not making sense.
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Sheesh, what is it with my threads. I go away for the weekend leaving a perfectly reasonable discussion about strippers, come back and it's turned to this?
(Great discussion up until the last little bit by the way, you make me proud)
Felix:
Damien you are sooo going to get lynched (again?) the next time you show up at 3.2
Yeah, but tell me it's not true. Tell me you can't name at least three right now who fit into that category... If you can't, I'll agree, pack my bags and leave Wellington immediately.
Actually, if you can't name 3,145 such political reporters immediately, same thing goes... ;)
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If you can't, I'll agree, pack my bags and leave Wellington immediately.
Are you worried you're being run out of town because of your article, Damian?
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As for modern music - it doesn't float my boat in any case, so I have no opinion about it. I'm more of a jazz, classical and opera woman. Each to their own.
A little Anna Netrebko always brightens my day.
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OK, I was thinking about the whole stripping thing a bit this weekend, & there are a few things that I'm curious about WRT to the sex industry.
A thought that follows on from discussion about the gender imbalance - that the sex industry is primarily women catering to the needs of men. It's easy to suggest the absence of an equivalent industry catering to women is proof of gender power imbalance, but I think it's a bad example, as there's a big difference in what triggers sexual arousal in men & women. Men tend to be turned on by what they see - generally, naked woman = aroused man. However, as thousands of pages of soft porn in such upstanding publications as Cosmo would vouch, outside an actual sexual encounter, women seem to get their kicks more from elaborate fictional accounts: often imagining the kinds of scenarios that there's no way they'd ever want to act out. So in that respect, even in a completely balanced world, I don't think there'd be the call for a male stripping industry in the same way as female. This kind of plays out in the traditional difference between a "girls' night out" hooting over men strutting around in their g-strings, and men hiding in corners and jerking off over writhing girls. Perhaps there's a sex-in-the-city kind of market for day spas with erotic massages? Again, I'm not sure whether women would just think this is a kinky idea, but wouldn't actually want to go there.
Also, based on the idea that perhaps female stripping is starting to fall more into line with male stripping in the way it's becoming more of a "fun night out" - and I imagine this is one angle that'd be pushed by that branch of feminists who think we need to empower women in the sex industry rather than rescuing them from it. Would this mainstreaming of the profession - particularly sliding emphasis away from sexual gratification - detrimentally affect a stripper's income? Surely all the money that's to be made in the industry is because of the more seedy element? With that in mind, I'm also curious to know what kind of wage difference there is between male and female strippers.
Also, someone mentioned rent boys before, suggesting that prostitution isn't purely a feminist issue. What proportion of transactions involve male escorts sleeping with women though? I was under the assumption - and I have no idea whether I've just been watching too many arthaus movies - that men still make up the bulk of their client base. I'm not sure what my point is there, but just I don't think the existence of rent boys implies the industry is any better balanced.
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Once upon a time haka parties were a feature of graduation/capping celebrations at most NZ Unis. Students, mostly engineers and science/footy types, would dress up in grass skirts, silly hats (top hats were all the go), and fake facial tatts. Then they'd sally forth to wreak drunken mayhem in the socially-approved manner of the times.
Ah yes, such a long time ago: drunken engineering students never do the haka when they're rioting these days ;-)
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I would say it is probably too early to tell - if women and men both continue to participate equally in the workplace, and earn similar sums, have similar aspirations socially/for work, who knows where the sex industry (and comparative demand) will end up in 20-30 years?
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What proportion of transactions involve male escorts sleeping with women though?
Okay, I'm now doing what I've been trying to avoid and theorising about an industry I have no experience of, but I would think 'more since Viagra'. Previously, biology would handicap men working as prostitutes for women (ie as penetrative partners, rather than rent boys as receptive partners) because they'd need to be aroused to have sex.
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Are you worried you're being run out of town because of your article, Damian?
I've just caught up on all the bile floating around, thanks for the link Joanna. Hardly surprising, and seems mainly to be the result of one strange little individual who's obviously had a problem with me for a decade or so now (did I steal his girlfriend, hit on his mother, run over his kitten, what?).
Anyway, what's the problem with you Wellingtonians, can't you read properly? It was supposed to be a *positive* article. Well, kinda....
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drunken engineering students never do the haka when they're rioting these days ;-)
I don't know if they were Engineering students, but those riotus folk down Dunedin at weekend were definitely doing the Haka.
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I don't know if they were Engineering students, but those riotus folk down Dunedin at weekend were definitely doing the Haka.
Was after the Undie 500, which is run by ENSOC. That doesn't mean that all or even most of the people involved were engineering students, but there's a definite association. When I was at uni, back before the invention of fire, we used 'engineer' to refer to a particular behaviour, not a degree choice.
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I don't know if they were Engineering students, but those riotus folk down Dunedin at weekend were definitely doing the Haka.
Sorry, must have missed out the <sarcasm weight="heavy"> tags.
When I was at uni, back before the invention of fire, we used 'engineer' to refer to a particular behaviour, not a degree choice.
That's my recollection too, and what didn't ring quite true about the "mostly engineers and science/footy types" quote earlier. In my experience, we science students were definitely geeks rather than jocks, and while the engineers across the river were getting ready for the chunder mile we'd be planning a riotous weekend of Scrabble and watching Carl Sagan videos.
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Heather: you might find this interesting and apropos. (A review of Audacia Ray's Naked on the Internet).
Interesting bit embedded in it:
One thing that she highlights that I found interesting was the widespread notion amongst women who are trying to cut out a feminist space in porn that women don’t look at porn as much as men strictly because of the male gaze issues.** Written erotica was deemed more female-friendly not because of inherent preferences for visual porn for men and written porn for women, but because it was much easier for women to find written material where you’re not going to encounter some huge misogynist turn-off. In other words, that women don’t look at porn is a supply, not a demand issue. The owners of one porn portal website aimed at straight women bemoaned their inability to meet the demand for new pictures, since they have to buy explicit pictures of men mostly from photographers who are aiming for a gay male audience, and then they have to work at it to recontextualize the pictures for a straight female audience. It was really interesting, and I went to their website to see how good a job they did, only to find that you have to pay to really see a lot of pictures, which I found interesting as well—if they’re able to make a living off this project, that pretty much does show that there’s more demand out there than the “women don’t look” stereotypes would have it. All in all, I found that section pretty persuasive.
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Awesome, thanks for that, Stephen. It's a take that never occurred to me before.
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Written erotica was deemed more female-friendly not because of inherent preferences for visual porn for men and written porn for women, but because it was much easier for women to find written material where you’re not going to encounter some huge misogynist turn-off. In other words, that women don’t look at porn is a supply, not a demand issue.
Interesting point, although I think porn, like everything else, has been democratised somewhat by social media. There are probably heaps of by-women-for-women erotica blogs.
In the interests of research, I turned off cookies and found this one, by a porn-for-women publisher (not exactly worksafe, but contains a surprising amount of good reading!)
The indie-porn/amateur thing, a la Indie Nudes, has problably made things safer for women, if they want to see pictures of men and women having consensual sex, but, clearly, I don't know what women might want to look at. Probably not recontextualised gay porn, though.
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There are probably heaps of by-women-for-women erotica blogs....I don't know what women might want to look at. Probably not recontextualised gay porn, though.
And then there's the slightly odd phenomenon of slashfic (gay male pr0n lit), the vast majority of which is written by women. I can testify from my personal acquaintance that there are women who really like reading, writing and looking at gay male pr0n.
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And then there's the slightly odd phenomenon of slashfic (gay male pr0n lit), the vast majority of which is written by women.
Forgot about that. And there's even Harry Potter slash! Eeew!
I can testify from my personal acquaintance that there are women who really like reading, writing and looking at gay male pr0n.
Because it's transgressive without being threatening?
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RB's link might be borderline NSFW, but these are all 'scientific' / 'for research purposes' ...
Students React to Watching Pornography in the Classroom
By a show of hands after the viewing, the class expressed that it was the man-on-man pornography, which featured oral and anal sex, that caused students to go furthest outside their comfort zone.
The result? No matter what the pairing - whether male/female or female/female - the subjects had similar reactions to both, and according to Bailey this proves that women will respond to anything, regardless of their sexual orientation.
The same could not be said of straight or gay men, however - last year Bailey and Chivers initiated a similar study in Chicago for men, and discovered that straight men were aroused by watching straight sex, and gay men were aroused by gay sex, and ne'er the twain did meet.
What Do Pornography and Feminism Have in Common?
In about 15 minutes we’re all piling into the car – daughters, dogs, the whole gang – and taking Peggy into the city to catch a plane to the Good for Her Feminist Porn Awards in Toronto.
scroll down further also for:
What Do Women Watch?About half the people who buy DVDs directly from us are women, and our films do very well at stores that cater to women. We know from the letters we get that these women are enjoying watching our films both alone and with their lovers.
A Straight Woman Looks at Gay Male Porn
I am just explaining why a woman does not have to identify in order to respond to gay porn, but can, from an empathetic place, experience a symbiotic sexualness.
Now I'm off to change my username to Sir Linksalot ...
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